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  #61  
Old 04-22-2012, 12:13 PM
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could you let the user define the input, which would accept both keystrokes and gamepad presses?

having some gamepad issue right now where the ship is spinning in circles when i start in joystick mode. i'll try it again later and see what happens.
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Old 04-22-2012, 02:37 PM
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That is the plan. A key mapping routine. There is a few things I need to get in order, then I will work on that before going on.

The rotation is a known issue. It happens with digital joysticks as well as analog sticks in digital mode. This mode could still have one analog stick. For now you need a gamepad with dual analog and it has to be in the dual analog mode. If your stick or pad does not have a mode button it will not work. Only one analog axis is needed so I hope to figure out how to get a single analog device to work correctly.

For the Gravitar ship, the X key works as well as the stick.
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Old 04-22-2012, 05:39 PM
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okay, i'll try messing around with the mode button on this logitech. dunno if that's the type of mode button you mean or whether you're referring to something different.

re: X key,
my hands are often in pain which is why i would like to use the gamepad to test if possible.

good to hear about the key-mapping routine, which i presume you'll add to more of your games.
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  #64  
Old 04-23-2012, 01:06 AM
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The new update for the lower res version is up. It has a key mapper and some other changes. I will upload the HD version tomorrow.
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  #65  
Old 04-23-2012, 02:57 AM
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better. and that should make kristian happy. can you have it take gamepad inputs as well, or would that be too confusing?

ship is still rotating wildly in gamepad input. pressing 'mode' on the logitech didn't change anything here.

the thickened walls look good to me for the cavern area.
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  #66  
Old 04-23-2012, 10:01 AM
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This routine I threw in is just key polling. The joystick could be made to work that way with a separate routine, and they could be merged.

First I need to find out about the rotation problem.

How would you like the gamepad to work? If it is as logical as the keyboard layout suggestion, it too might be the default. If I can not whip something up easy enough, I will make a build how you like it. It's great that I have two testers and guides that love this type of game that have the two controller preferences. Thanks guys.
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  #67  
Old 04-24-2012, 07:40 AM
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okay, the problem was on my end. i plugged in my second logitech and the auto-rotation problem went away. seems that on the original controller the right analog stick must have gotten out of calibration with respect to this particular game, causing it to register a push when none (or very very little) was physically happening. maybe the ranges were set really tight since that stick has never given me such problems before. *shrug*

which brings me to a logistics issue- using analog controls when in 'gravitar' mode is very awkward. it should really be buttons-only IMO.

that also kind of leads in to the clash between gravitar controls and lander controls. that is, i think getting comfy with one button for thrust clashes a lot with getting comfy with a range of thrusts, i.e. analog. they just don't mesh well IMO. better would be to ditch the analog input idea and just go with digital on's or off's. most of the many, many lander games i've played have indeed been push button affairs with little less for the loss.

anyway, something to think about.

re: setting the controls,
ideally it would be like MAME where you can see a list of commands next to the inputs that correspond to them. otherwise, taking gamepad input through polling is okay. not a huge deal, really.
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  #68  
Old 04-24-2012, 09:40 AM
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Yeah, the problem is not analog control but that everything is treated as analog. I worked on that last night and made progress, but had the code in a state I no longer trusted so reverted. I'm working on converting the control for everything, other than landers' thrust to work as digitally on the dual analog stick. The change will be unnoticeable to a perfectly calibrated analog control, as it is now if working, but it will eliminate the problem of having no dead zone.

There are two ways to fix this. one is simple using a different function which reads direction, and not position of an axis. This has to be the X/Y axis though. Another is to hard code a dead zone and ignore readings outside a range.

Ideally, in my mind for a dual analog stick, is right stick thrust, left hat switch fire and thrust/shield. For ease and less movement.

Remember, we are talking about devices, but it is really all about axis.
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  #69  
Old 04-25-2012, 01:28 AM
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The reason I like checking the position of the stick vs the direction of the stick has nothing to do with analog vs digital, though that is the case. Using position, one reading will tell if the stick is to the left. Up left, down left, it's all left. Using direction I would have to check left, up left, and down left, all, and separately. I don't want rotation to stop if you wonder into a diag.

I think I have fixed the problem that you had Ike, that I did not, with the rotation even in analog mode. I did have it when thrusting though, it would cause rotation if the stick was not calibrated. You were right, the settings were too tight with no margin for error. There is a 10% dead zone now.

- All planets in the first level have worlds, but two are the same, and one is from level 2. - The lander world is moved to planet 4 (upper left), which the Gravitar level belongs. The world from level two is on planet three (lower left) and is a retro level, meaning the guns and fuel tanks are as in the arcade. The status of each planet is maintained till the mission there is complete.
- When you leave a world, you spawn at that planet, unless the mission is complete, or you left because you were killed, then you spawn at your home base. you show up below the home base, and the aliens above, simulating you are in it. You are also safe from enemy fire inside there.
- Explosions are now particles instead of the cheezy sprite. More realistic, but they fade away.
_ Scoring is in, lives are in. Still need to do the bonuses time and score.

The pic is from the retro world. It looks pretty nice as far as simulating the vector lines with double intensity at overlap.
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  #70  
Old 04-25-2012, 02:00 AM
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It's hard to tell if the Gravitar ship has friction, or if the thrust builds up fast. The physics are a little confusing, because the ship tends to surge. It's like gravity has more effect on momentum than a pulling to it's point. Must be friction, but possibly dynamic. I will get it.
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  #71  
Old 04-25-2012, 12:21 PM
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Once I can get my gamepad set up with digital controls I'll be happy to do some actual gameplay testing. I suppose I could just use RBjoy until you work out these control issues. Okay, problem solved.
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  #72  
Old 04-25-2012, 01:21 PM
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No digital controller will work. RBjoy or joy2key etc. will make it work though, just be sure to press 1 on the keyboard and not button one on the controller so the joystick is not read by the game code. I'm assuming this. I have not tested it.

I have joystick control that works, keyboard control that works and can be re-mapped. I'm not saying I am done with control, I am not. Using a joystick always assumes the device is compatible. Some pads have digital and analog control. My steelseries rumble pad is like this. some are all digital and some are all analog. I use to have a dual stick controller that the mode button would switch from dual analog to one analog and one digital.
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  #73  
Old 04-25-2012, 09:35 PM
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For the lower res version, actually for both, but motivated by the low res version I have made the solar system (planet select) screen more compact, which makes the ship bigger there. It matches the arcade version. I also am in the process of editing the vector style font (vector battle) to have much wider lines and saving it as a new font. I also edited out the hash on the zeros and saved another named Asteroids with thin lines and no hash.

The lower res version will look very nice. The first solar system will be done in about a week and hopefully physics dialed in as well, which would made the rest of the game mostly graphics work. I will release a demo then that has the first solar system and the select screen for the next, and for the time reverse gravity or make the terrain invisible or something using the same worlds. Lunar Lander would be a trip without seeing the mountains and valleys.

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Old 04-26-2012, 01:03 AM
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The screenshot shows the new scale of the select screen, the new font (which actually only the letters I use so far, and the numbers are done), the reader boards are falling into place (the old one will only show when playing Lunar Lander), and the timer of the planet bonus is working for planet one.

The planet objects will need to have the aspect ratio adjusted now. The objects will have a square aspect ratio, at 16/10.

The super bonus in Gravitar is in my opinion uninspired, giving a relative massive amount of points based on which planet you complete the mission on first. It really serves no purpose but inflate the score, though it does inspire you to do the most difficult planet first, the link planet. The cameo games in my version will be the super bonus. On the first system placing a flag on each pad will give you the super bonus points. In system two it will be an Omega Race game for bonus points, and so on with a bonus game on every system. Maybe you will play level one of those games, and if you cycle back to the start of Gravitar you will play the next level of those games, while the Gravitar game will have reversed gravity on level two. There will be 12 planets per level, 4 each plus the link, so 3 cameo games. Lunar Lander, Omega Race, and another.
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Old 04-26-2012, 08:39 AM
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i'm more of a lunar lander and oids guy than a gravitar guy. no idea about those bonuses, and i'm not all that familiar with the official planetary layouts. hopefully kristian or someone else can drop in and give feedback on that stuff.

anyway, RBjoy is working okay and i'm trying to test the 1st cavern area. i must say it's kind of a pain after every death to have to fly back over there and squeeze through that tunnel to get back to what i was doing. if there was a shortcut for testing, that would help. maybe key "1" would jump you to the cavern in world one, etc.....
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Old 04-26-2012, 10:47 AM
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I'll check that out. After the lander is destroyed anywhere, it should spawn above the surface near where it does in the arcade version.
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Old 04-26-2012, 10:45 PM
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The fixed res, 1024x768 version is updated and uploaded.

You can jump, right into Lunar Lander by pressing L at the title screen.

Lunar Gravitar wip - Pinball Nirvana Forums Lunar Gravitar wip - Pinball Nirvana Forums

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Old 04-26-2012, 10:53 PM
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The HD version is uploaded as well.

second post in this thread

Lunar Gravitar wip - Pinball Nirvana Forums Lunar Gravitar wip - Pinball Nirvana Forums
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  #79  
Old 04-27-2012, 11:21 PM
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Hi Shocky.... been really busy with my house (construction work)... will test this as soon as possible... looking good...!!
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Old 04-30-2012, 07:13 PM
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The HD version is updated to 0.6.3

- Lots of behavior changes.
- All planets in the first system have landscapes respective of the arcade version. There are differences in guns and fuel pods. Planet 1 for example has turrets on the base. Other planets have turrets on the bunkers. Planet 3 of the second solar system has original arcade guns and fuel pods. I will choose a style as universal.
-The second system has planets 3 and 4 , also modeled after the arcade version, and the link. The link for now links the two systems without changes. You can do half of system one, link to system 2 and come back to one to find it as you left it.
-Link planet two has turrets in it. Unlike the arcade version, in which you don't see them until you engage the reactor, you see these on the way in, but they are inactive. These too are the arcade style bunkers that fire blindly. They have a proximity detector that activates them. All turrets in the game does. The arcade don't.
-Bonuses for every planet in the game. Runs down as you play the landscape. The remainder is awarded when you complete that mission and escape the planet without crashing or being shot. The bonus is shown at spawn at the system map.
-You are placed close to the planet when you leave it, with a mission complete or not. if you are killed you are place at your home base.

It's a friggen hard game, and my version is hard as well. The control of the ship is slower and smoother but still some of the landscapes take some trial and error and planning to get these turrets without crashing.

IF it is too hard type IF at the title screen or just I or just F. I is an improved invincibility where you are truly invincible now, but be careful to not get lost off screen below the landscape, as there is not a lot of point to code wrap or bounce for a test function. If it creates a problem I could add a upright function key. F is unlimited fuel. I is reversible with the O key and you can still play with limited fuel with the F hot key that in the game just adds 400 units.

Lunar Gravitar wip - Pinball Nirvana Forums Lunar Gravitar wip - Pinball Nirvana Forums
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  #81  
Old 04-30-2012, 07:28 PM
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cool- sounds good. let's see if tonight will be a good night to get back to testing.

btw, do you have people at the yoyo forums doing some testing as well?
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:09 PM
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It has not even been downloaded there as far as I know. There are 4 people I could ask and they will do it, but I have not talked with them yet. The last version was put up there for the first time. Being in the WIP section, and the fact that it is old school, makes it a bit obscure. My finished releases are not even downloaded a lot, but are rated high by those that do.

You Ike, will want to get the first post version for lower resolution, fully scaled to your monitor. I'm going to update that version now.

If anyone wants a 4/3 version I could force that as well (no monitor stretching).
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:22 PM
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Default Lunar Gravitar v0.6.3

lower resolution version Updated. Exactly in sync with the HD version, but with 1024x768 viewports.

Lunar Gravitar wip - Pinball Nirvana Forums Lunar Gravitar wip - Pinball Nirvana Forums

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Old 04-30-2012, 11:00 PM
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Since no one has downloaded it yet, I sneaked in a minor update that fixed some things with the lander without bumping the revision. Lower res version only so far.

This version I fear is going to have to have a major adjustment, being native 1024x768 instead of the scaling down of the larger surface, to make it sharper.

I am leaning towards only Gravitar and Lander now, and this lander landscape will be one of the harder levels and in it's place wider pads on an easier landscape.

I know I need to get the Gravitar section of the lander planet to look better as well.
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Old 05-01-2012, 11:18 PM
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Things that are fixed for the next release which will be at the earliest when I finish the planets for the second solar system. Probably tomorrow.

- More improvements to the lander.
- Lander has it's own fuel supply.
- Fixed super bonus puking out points till the timer to display the text ended.
- Bonus countdown is suspended while playing the lander.
- Ships now crash into the landed ship. only the flying one is destroyed.
- Fixed super bonus and made it 20000 points (exactly lander which is 400 per pad). I am going to make it give the pad total, then if all, a exactly multiplier.
- Fixed bonus amount for planet 3 of system two.
- Depth adjustments. this broke some depth issues with the temp invincibility cheat. Not a big deal.
- Improved the subterranean planet 4 of system graphics.
- Fanfare sound when mission complete.
- More realistic alien pursuit pattern. needs work though. The shooting aliens hold back and fire, the could run into you, but they tend not to. A bit elusive. The rammers will ram, but not a direct move towards like before.
- Alien shoot sound.
- Game Over. five lives.
- Bullet proof cheat. more fun. shots don't kill you, but collisions with ships and land will. Invisibility will work as before and will turn on bullet proof.
- Infinite lives cheat.
- Cycle through systems with the S key.
- Worked on sounds and volume levels.
- Turrets will not fire on lander. They probably should, but a couple is so close and trying to fire through the ground. It don't sound good. If I can make them smarter (line of sight), I will certainly have them fire at the lander.
- The third solar system is complete. Just 5 more planet landscapes to build.

TIPS,
- Don't rotate the lander before you cleared the pad a few feet.
- Pick up the fuel pod on the surface of planet 4 which will be added to the landers supply.
- Be careful not to go for another land pad if you don't have enough fuel. Watch the fuel closely. Save enough to either get back to the fighter, or to fly up and out to the solar system.
- If you really want the super bonus, save some turrets for last. If the mission is complete and you crash the lander, out of fuel or not, you will be returned to the solar system and the planet is gone.
- Use your home base as a shield. You can shoot out through it, but the aliens can not.
- Be careful when approaching the alien planet, as that is where the aliens are spawning. After some time the safety is stale and they can spawn.
- Try to get all the turrets in planet 4 of system one, the subterranean one on an orbital run without thrusting after setting the orbit. It's possible, if you enter the orbit just right.
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Old 05-02-2012, 08:34 PM
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Last compile gave an out of system resources error. This is not good. I am going to have to create a cleaner environment, and optimism the game. It's a bummer, but not so big a surprise. Just running game booster and deleting some .pngs I used as templates has it running again, but that will probably not remain enough. I only need to squeeze in three more worldscapes and the rest is code manipulation. I do have some lazy routines in it that can be re-written, but I will have to learn some things.

At this rate still I expect a beta version virtually complete in 1 1/2 to three weeks.

The .exe will not have the overhead of the dev. kit. If I can compile it, you can run it.
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Old 05-02-2012, 11:59 PM
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"Out of resources error?" Seriously? Are you designing for a C64 or for modern systems in which conserving resources is a base affront to how the modern paradigm works?

Dear, dear, dear.

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Old 05-03-2012, 01:35 AM
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I'll tell you what the problem is. This new computer I am using does not have a GPU other than the on-board one that shares the ram. That's the first part. The second is that all the landscapes are sprites, and some of them are bigger than the screen which is 1920x1080 in the version I am working on. If they were full color and had alpha trans. it would have been over much sooner.

The reason I use massive sprites, is because GM does not have sprite, or object to background collision, and if it did it would be very slow. The only alternative to sprites is math coords. and I would not be a quarter of the way through the first landscape, and that would be very slow as well anyway. There is one other way and that is checking on a pixel by pixel bases (color) and that is very slow too.

Not relevant, but in line, GM does not have a flood fill function. People have written routines to do that, but to fill one if these landscapes, if I was doing that, would take minutes, not seconds.

New computers can run out of resources, it's just that it takes a lot of resources to max them out. This game might require a minimum specs statement, but I would not know how to calculate that.

Another reason is that I am not a master of programming by any means. I have spent this evening Optimizing the game, and the problem is bumped ahead. How far ahead, I don't know. The graphics is the hog, but I can take some comfort in the fact that I am using on-board gpu sharing the ram. So, as I said, if I can compile it, you can run it.

The sounds are pre-loaded. They are not huge files, but this takes resources. If they weren't there would be a loading time the first time each one was used.

Scaling back on the idea is always an option, and that dates back to forever.

I have all the solar systems zooming and animating. I have the planets in the first two systems in, and that just leaves 3 more for the last system, though I hope to get 4 in it. The forth being the last and hardest Lunar Lander super bonus planet.

After getting the game back to compiling I made the second link planet hide the guns till the reactor is activated, and made the third one have more guns, and start with the guns showing and activated. Unlike the planets, the alien link planets restart with all the guns, even the ones you shot last time, and the regular planets hold your progress in that respect as well as spent fuel pods.

The remaining planets might be done in a day or two. Then it's just a matter of going through the three systems again, changing variables.

In the end you will not be able to link back to a previous system and find the planets as you left them, you will cycle forward, and that will free up a lot of resources. When a mission complete message appears and you leave that planet, It will be deleted and all the guns, fuel pods etc. as well. It's the same amount of objects, just keeping the instances of those in check.
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Old 05-03-2012, 01:51 AM
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I actually need to put one more level in one of the planets in the second system. It was going to be one with the lander bonus game. I will just clone the first lander level and put it in, this will just take a couple of minutes, then I will clone the levels of system two for system three. If instead of just calling the same routines I actually made clones of them it would tell me for sure that I have room to make unique ones before I commit to building another solar system. Then it can be out for testing maybe tomorrow.


EDIT,

I think it was all the running of the game, testing code. I know I am not freeing up everything, so there is a memory leak. I restarted the computer and cloned the sprites and backgrounds and everything. All the resources the game will need is now part of the code. They just need unique drawing. There is no problem. I will be sure to give you all your memory back before I release it.

Last edited by Shockman; 05-03-2012 at 02:47 AM.
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Old 05-03-2012, 04:32 AM
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Here is a sample of the font I am creating for this game. It will especially make the lower resolution version much better.

The sample shows an F. Its actually two. The first one is white, and the second one is off white over it. The white is the upper case and the top is lower case. It is notched so the glow at the intersections is more. It is thicker so is nice looking and easier to read when scaled.

It's a .ttf font, not a picture. It was actually made using cut and paste of the actual font via MAME into the High Logic font editor. It will have off size letters to match the Gravitar arcade vectors. It's a bit fat, but I had the game on double line thickness, otherwise I could not see the aliens and turrets shots in MAME.
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