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  #31  
Old 07-30-2009, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolas.b View Post
i had believed for years that man was the 'bad guy', off-track in his pursuits and incredibly cavalier towards animals and nature for quite some time now. then lately i begrudged the fact that the problem is inherant in all life. this knocked my deep reverance for all forms of life down a bit (although the reverance is starting to resurface in different ways). and now i'm back to thinking of man as the bad guy, just not as bad as before.

why? because the difference between us and the other lifeforms on earth is that we have more free intelligence than any of them to throw back at the 'civilisation and extinction' problem and prevent it from getting out of control. notwithstanding the fact that we (mostly) are the ones responsible for the current / impending crash, it was man's responsibility more than anything / anyone else's to prevent it. which is not to say that some of us didn't try and aren't trying- it's just that the forces of selfishness inherant in life were always a bit stronger. it's one of those struggles which seems to be always unequal, which is to say a losing struggle for control and a winning one for entropy.
Exactly. That's a great way of putting it.

I'm not sure if it's selfishness, most people are capable of being very unselfish. Sure a few people with power and or money acting selfishly can do some damage, but for the human race as a whole it's different.

Since you brought up entropy, that's probably the best answer, the vast majority of people only learn what they need to learn to survive, minimal energy expended... So even though the potential is there for everyone to be more enlightened and understanding of the global problems, it would be somewhat against the natural way things work for the vast majority of the population to put in the effort.

The irony is that it is the vast majority that are just getting by on minimal education that support our civilization, making it possible for a smaller percentage of people to invent necessary stuff that keeps civilization going as it grows. Is that a "catch 22" or "chicken or egg" thing? Not sure...

So for an abstract thing to blame, it's civilization itself.

As a great philosopher once said: "don't worry, be happy". Easier said then done a lot of the time but certainly worth trying.
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  #32  
Old 07-30-2009, 03:43 PM
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Sounds like you're taking too much fish oil Nic.
If you're taking fish oil containing Vitamin A or Vitamin D, then it's vitaminosis which is a fancy word for vitamin poisoning. Fat soluble vitamins like A and D are toxic in large doses.
If you're taking Omega 3 to cut cholesterol which has been stripped of A and D, then you might be overdoing it. Too little cholesterol will give you headaches and is also not recommended.

You like Beach Boys? I like Wouldn't it be Nice, California Girls, Good Vibrations, Vegetables, Surf's Up and Sail On Sailor, and I *might throw in Jobim-Aqua De Marco or Astrud Gilberto Quiet Nights of Quiet Stars:









And I Might slip in Vince Guaraldi/Cast Your Fate to the Wind, or does everything have to match a theme?
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  #33  
Old 07-30-2009, 09:17 PM
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thanks, guys. more comments later.

409
Add Some Music
All Dressed up for School
All Summer Long
Ballad of Ole' Betsy
Barbara Ann
Be True To Your School
Cabinessence
California Girls
Car Crazy Cutie
Carl's Big Chance
Caroline No
Catch A Wave
Come Go with Me
Cotton Fields
Cuckoo Clock
Dance, Dance, Dance
Darlin'
Diamond Head
Do It Again
Do You Wanna Dance
Don't Back Down
Dont Talk
Don't Worry Baby
Drive-In
Finders Keepers
Friends
Fun, Fun, Fun
Getcha Back
Girl Don't Tell Me
Girls on the Beach
God Only Knows
Good Timin'
Good Vibrations
Help Me, Rhonda
Here Today
Heroes and Villains
Honky Tonk
Hushabye
I Can Hear Music
I Get Around
In My Room
Kokomo
Let Him Run Wild
Let's Go Trippin'
Little Deuce Coupe
Little Honda
Little Saint Nick
Misirlou
Noble Surfer
Passing By
Rock & Roll Music
Sail On Sailor
Shut Down
Sloop John B
Surfer Girl
Surfin' Safari
Surfin' U.S.A
Surfin'
Surf's Up
The Girls On The Beach
The Warmth Of The Sun
Till I Die
We'll Run Away
Wendy
When I Grow Up (To Be a Man)
Whistle In
Wild Honey
Wonderful
Wouldn't It Be Nice
You're So Good To Me

i didn't realise that they had so many good songs until i went looking recently. for all i know, there's still a lot more!


EDIT: nice call, arne. i like bossa nova a lot, and waters of march is one of my very favorite songs of all time.

Last edited by Ike Savage; 07-30-2009 at 09:23 PM.
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  #34  
Old 07-31-2009, 01:58 AM
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I still can't make out the theme, or is it that your brother loves The Beach Boys?
If it's for partying, along with the boys there was also Jan and Dean with Ride the Wild Surf, Surf City, Little Old Lady From Pasadena, and Dead Man's Curve, and if it's about old school partying, you might want a copy of Louie, Louie by The Kingsmen, but for a wedding I would go with Just the Way You Are/Billy Joel.
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  #35  
Old 07-31-2009, 02:58 AM
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the theme is simply good beach boys tunes for this summer trip. no idea what he's playing at the wedding / reception, although i plan on dancing like a fool unless my CFS prevents me from doing so. i like those J&D hits, so those might make some worthy additions.
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  #36  
Old 07-31-2009, 01:36 PM
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Great list of BB songs. Few on there I'm not sure I've heard, but probably have and just don't know the correct name.

Got one original vinyl album of theirs around somewhere, and it is the one with the car theme and has 409 and little deuce coupe on it.

Edit: looked it up it's their 4th album, pretty much all great songs:

4) LITTLE DEUCE COUPE

1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.
11.
12.
Little Deuce Coupe
Ballad Of Ole' Betsy
Be True To Your School
Car Crazy Cutie
Cherry, Cherry Coupe
409
Shut Down
Spirit Of America
Our Car Club
No-Go Showboat
A Young Man Is Gone
Custom Machine
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  #37  
Old 07-31-2009, 07:57 PM
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My brother had a copy of that album and I never realized how much of a concept album it was until I saw your list and remembered a few things. I'm noticing the flow of the titles from great expectations (Little Deuce Coupe) and sentiment (Ole' Betsy) through duty to your school, then the night and the cutie, the following day and 409/Shut Down/Spirit of America, then the car club grouping, but then the dropping out with No Go. And then we hit "A Young Man is Gone" which is a song about James Dean who died in a car accident.
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  #38  
Old 08-01-2009, 12:18 AM
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@bill,
"feel flows" was interesting- listened to it on youtube because i hadn't heard it before. quite likely all of the songs i listed above are available on youtube, so you can tell me what you think of some of my more obscure picks. here's one that i think is meditative / pretty / somewhat haunting, "till i die":
Code:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OcUeSDMll5s
it's one of those tunes i can set to autoplay and kind of zone out on...


@marty,
thanks, and by "selfish" i meant in the ways that i had described the very character of life as being selfish, ie in the core programming.

interesting catch-22 / chicken and egg thing you bring up. the populace is the pond, perhaps, and when the inventors / innovators throw a pebble in, the ripples begin transforming the populace and eventually reach to every corner.


@arne,
yea, from what i've read, "little deuce coupe" was rock's original concept album. every single song about a car, with the possible overtones of meaning that you mention.

it's also been fun reading and re-reading the fascinating history behind the beach boys- their origins with their semi-tyrant father, their rivalry with the beatles, their incredible song output over the years, mike love's simmering and historic resentment at brian wilson's influence and acclaim, the power struggle involving brian wanting to make concept music while mike wanted to make 'hit' music, brian's legendary nervous breakdown trying to make the album which would top "sgt. pepper", his descent into drugs and isolation, his revivals, the helpful / harmful shrink who gained power over him, dennis wilson marrying mike's illegitimate daughter, the tragic deaths of brian's brothers, his daughters forming their own successful band with the daughter of the mamas and papas' singer, mike's eventual gaining control of the official band, brian finally releasing "smile", mike's brother being an NBA player and last season his nephew becoming one of the top NBA draft picks.

re: fish oil,
it's straight, without supplements- EPA, DHA and omega-3 fatty acids. on the vitamin overdose, that's more something i have to watch with hitting up the carrot juice pretty good this summer. on a side note, my aunt said that EPA and DHA are major chemical constituents of... the cerebellum, i believe it was. haven't checked it out, but i think i'll be dropping the fish oil entirely given how common it is for people to have headaches when dosing it.


@all,
i've been reading a bit about the life of siddartha (buddha) lately, and he seems to say some good things with regard to the thread topic. for example, that suffering is inherant to existence and that all things are impermanent. i don't really understand his other principles, but there's a start. i'm going to keep reading.
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  #39  
Old 08-01-2009, 04:21 AM
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I got fucking ripped off! My version of Little Deuce Coupe was issued by Pickwick, a bargain-basement reissue label owned by Musicland/Sam Goody, and it had about half the songs on it that Arne's version has! I bought that about the time I was 12, about the same time I bought Surf's Up, which I couldn't quite get my head around. Not a single song about surfing! What a rip-off to a 12-year-old. I never heard "Feel Flows" until it was on the Almost Famous soundtrack, and really missed out on that great "Til I Die" track. I need to find that album again!
Speaking of Mike Love (as much as I hate to), I felt a certain amount of satisfaction when Brian rewrote the lyrics to "Good Vibrations" on Smile so Mike wouldn't get any money out of it.

I gotta admit, Nic, your list pretty much covers the gamut. One that I would include is one of my all-time favorites from Pet Sounds:

" title="YouTube - The Beach Boys - I'm Waiting For The Day" target="_blank">YouTube - The Beach Boys - I'm Waiting For The Day

Love the drums and the production.

Pet Sounds is better than Sgt. Pepper's. Discuss.

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  #40  
Old 08-01-2009, 12:46 PM
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A lot of The Beach Boys' mythos is fiction and the rest is substitution by rejuxtaposition of the facts involving people and things that were true at the time I'm sure, though I cannot explain it.

With respect to Sgt. Pepper, I was thinking Pet Sounds was inspired by The Beatles' Revolver, but it turns out it was inspired by Rubber Soul instead.

Pet_sounds Pet_sounds
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Old 08-01-2009, 01:25 PM
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Here's some interesting background from wikipedia on Little Deuce Coupe.

Little_Deuce_Coupe Little_Deuce_Coupe
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  #42  
Old 08-01-2009, 09:45 PM
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i think pet sounds loses points next to sgt peppers because more of its strength was tied up in innovation, the thrust of which is going to quickly erode in a technology-driven culture. sgt peppers wasn't as innovative, but the songs were crafted and polished to perfection, remaining relatively timeless. IMO it was an unequal struggle too- basically three geniuses against one (lennon, mccartney, martin versus wilson). for a more fair comparison, i don't think any of those three guys individually ever put out a music project which could match pet sounds or the best brian-led projects, such as little deuce coupe.

from what i remember, the beatles heard pet sounds and were utterly blown away. they responded with sgt peppers, which brian was utterly blown away by. brian started to respond with smile, but that's where 'one against three' had a hand in wrecking him. simply an unbalanced fight.

EDIT: gotta hand it to mike in at least one way- "mike love, not war" is one of the best album titles i've ever heard.

EDIT2: sgt peppers might not have been as innovative as pet sounds, but i've never known a band with the chameleon-like quality of the beatles. not only was the talent unbelievable, but they could seemingly pick any genre or type of song and absolutely nail it on the head... before moving on to the very next song and mastering a completely different genre. i'm not sure most people realise how uncanny this talent was.

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  #43  
Old 08-01-2009, 10:29 PM
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There's also Chicago's "Wishing You Were Here" sung with The Beach Boys.



I'd throw in Bananarama's "Cruel Summer"
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  #44  
Old 08-01-2009, 10:47 PM
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side note: can't believe i forgot dennis being buddies and musical collaborator before falling out with another musician, name of charles manson.
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Old 08-01-2009, 11:27 PM
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Oh yeah, I know that one.

When I was working at Warner Bros./Reprise Records/Creative Services in 1976-77, the location was on Vanowen St., North Hollywood, next door to WEA Creative Services. WEA = Warner, Elektra, and Atlantic Records = WEA.

At least once or twice a week this guy dressed in casual sports attire not suitable for work except perhaps as an exec who was not coincidentaly a dead ringer for Carl Wilson would come over from the WEA side and talk to the senior shipper at my work table about "the upcoming Jimi Hendrix revival" and this was a running joke because Hendrix had passed away in '71 EDIT: 1970. At that time Warner Bros. on the side of the store where I worked was the distributor for Brother Records which was The Beach Boys' own label.
The Beach Boys had nothing to do with WEA at all. We had Beach Boys frisbees to mail out to the stores and I might have one tucked away in the ol' toy box. Hendrix was on Reprise Records.
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Old 08-02-2009, 02:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolas.b View Post
i think pet sounds loses points next to sgt peppers because more of its strength was tied up in innovation, the thrust of which is going to quickly erode in a technology-driven culture. sgt peppers wasn't as innovative, but the songs were crafted and polished to perfection, remaining relatively timeless. IMO it was an unequal struggle too- basically three geniuses against one (lennon, mccartney, martin versus wilson). for a more fair comparison, i don't think any of those three guys individually ever put out a music project which could match pet sounds or the best brian-led projects, such as little deuce coupe.

from what i remember, the beatles heard pet sounds and were utterly blown away. they responded with sgt peppers, which brian was utterly blown away by. brian started to respond with smile, but that's where 'one against three' had a hand in wrecking him. simply an unbalanced fight.

EDIT: gotta hand it to mike in at least one way- "mike love, not war" is one of the best album titles i've ever heard.

EDIT2: sgt peppers might not have been as innovative as pet sounds, but i've never known a band with the chameleon-like quality of the beatles. not only was the talent unbelievable, but they could seemingly pick any genre or type of song and absolutely nail it on the head... before moving on to the very next song and mastering a completely different genre. i'm not sure most people realise how uncanny this talent was.
Oddly enough, I've always felt just the opposite; When I listen to Pet Sounds today, its sound has a real timeless quality. It could easily have been recorded in the '70s or the '80s. Sgt. Pepper's always sounds firmly rooted in the '60s, from the by-today's-standards inept stereo production (vocals and guitars on one channel, bass and drums on the other) to songs that sound too '60s. The price of too much experimentation like calliope music and sitars is music that just doesn't age too well. Then again, that's coming from a guy who's firmly on the "Stones" side of the "Beatles vs. Stones" debate.

I think sleepy may have gotten the timeline nailed earlier: Brian heard Rubber Soul and recorded Pet Sounds; McCartney heard Pet Sounds and started cooking up Pepper's.

One thing that the Beach Boys and Beatles have in common is that people are still copying them 40 years later! Check out this cut from some stone Beach Boys fans! Could easily be a '60s outtake!
Attached Files
File Type: mp3 01 Forever.mp3 (3.48 MB, 424 views)
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  #47  
Old 08-02-2009, 03:57 AM
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hah! i don't think we'll find much agreement then if you're on the other side of the stones - beatles debate.

yea, that fan-made song sure nailed the BB aesthetic. not much else to comment on, but they sure got that part down.
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Old 08-02-2009, 02:09 PM
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Speaking of the Stones, they were what came to my mind when you talked about the "chameleon like quality" that the Beatles had. And Zeppelin to a lesser extent, they occasionally did some stuff far from their core sound.

For bands I could listen to just their songs for days, it would be those 3. Maybe The Who but I'd probably get tired of them after 1 day. When I was living in CT there was a station in NYC changing formats and played nothing but Beatles for I think 2 weeks, never got tired of it.
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Old 08-02-2009, 03:31 PM
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Stones not chameleons?

Their_Satanic_Majesties_Request Their_Satanic_Majesties_Request


As for Beatles sounding dated with sitars, there is no way Norwegian Wood would sound as good without it.

~Edvard Greig~
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Old 08-02-2009, 11:37 PM
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Oh, I agree when the use of sitar is more underrated that it can benefit a song like Norwegian Wood, or Brian Jones' sitar action on "Paint It, Black." I was speaking specifically about Sgt. Pepper's and, in that album's case of sitar overdose, "Within You, Without You"; from the lyrics to the music, there's no doubt in the listener's mind that it's obviously a song from the '60s, whereas "Norwegian Wood" has a more timeless quality that doesn't make it a prisoner of the decade it originated in.
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Old 08-03-2009, 12:50 AM
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any of you stones fans, feel free to pick me some of their obscure classics on youtube if you feel like it. i've heard all their major songs and (had) a couple LP's back in the day, but there's probably some little-known gems i don't know about, as with the beach boys' "till i die".
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Old 08-03-2009, 07:21 AM
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meanwhile, back at the ranch, wilt, arnold and andre pause for refreshment:
http://izismile.com/img/img2/2009080...ion_211_16.jpg

looking back at early emoticons:
http://izismile.com/img/img2/2009080...ion_211_14.jpg

jim and frank:
http://izismile.com/img/img2/2009080...ion_211_36.jpg

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Old 08-03-2009, 07:55 AM
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Well, I loused up posting it, but is Lady Jane too well known?

The youtube for Please Go Home isn't sounding like the psycho-reverb that I know is in the song, or the version that I would recommend, in stereo, otherwise I would have loused up posting it too.

I would have also loused up posting Back Street Girl and Jagger's solo effort, "Memo From Turner". I'll try to post them again in the morning after some sleep.
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Old 08-05-2009, 12:02 AM
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thanks, arne... i know all those songs except for "please go home". in fact that song illustrates a reason why i never got into the stones too much- overdriven guitars. i'm just not a fan of that sound.

was talking to a friend today about whether elvis' slower stuff was any good, so i tried listening to his first two albums online- they're quite nice! i'm surprised that his stuff is still listenable, or maybe summertime is a good time to do it. either way i might have to add some elvis to the trip collection. (as long as elvis costello doesn't mind)
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Old 08-05-2009, 02:37 AM
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OK Nic, here's one for you. This is one of my wife's favorite songs and I've heard it a thousand times. After listening to your Willie Nelson Karaoke, I would tend to think, that you might think you could sing this song also.

It starts out with the vocals very light, but don't give up on it as it will pick up and continue to build into a very uplifting and positive song that will lift you right out of your depression and send you off on your vacation with a positive attitude.



" title="YouTube - LOU CHRISTIE - BEYOND THE BLUE HORIZON" target="_blank">YouTube - LOU CHRISTIE - BEYOND THE BLUE HORIZON
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Old 08-05-2009, 02:05 PM
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I wish this was an Elvis Costello sighting. Back in '79 the local K-ROC station played a song that was in 3/4 or 6/8 waltz time with a line "the real double duchess"
and at the time I focused on this line to remember the song because I loved the tune and I remember the vocal sounding like Elvis Costello, and I thought the DJ later announced the song as being by Elvis Costello, and yet to this day I have never found it and I've only heard it one time on that day in '79.

This is as bad as an instrumental by, *I THOUGHT* Hugo Winterhalter that was used for the theme song for a local Late, Late Movie on the old KTLA Ch. 5 and which appeared on a custom 4 track cart with the name "Hugo Winterhalter Gold" in the early-mid 60's, extremely rare. It is Not the album "Hugo Winterhalter Latin Gold" or "Hawaian Gold" or even "Canadian Sunset" and definitely is Not "Blue Tango" or "Delicado", but it is in the style of "A Summer Place", except it is a twilight sound with soft melodic piano and strings.

It is an instrumental which appears to be out of print.
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Old 08-05-2009, 03:00 PM
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@bob,
great song, thanks!
no way i could ever sing that, but a nice addition to the collection.


@arne,
that's one of my favorite costello tunes, "new amsterdam":
Code:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZFcHF-wjBA
that whole album ("get happy") is awesome- a double album of good, peppy songs crammed into a single album. one of the many vinyls that i lost long ago...
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Old 08-05-2009, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepy View Post
I wish this was an Elvis Costello sighting. Back in '79 the local K-ROC station played a song that was in 3/4 or 6/8 waltz time with a line "the real double duchess"
and at the time I focused on this line to remember the song because I loved the tune and I remember the vocal sounding like Elvis Costello, and I thought the DJ later announced the song as being by Elvis Costello, and yet to this day I have never found it and I've only heard it one time on that day in '79.
Only lyric mentioning double dochess I could find is one by Costello:

New Amsterdam

You're sending me tulips mistaken for lilies
You give me your lip after punching me silly
You turned my head till it rolled down the brain drain
If I had any sense now I wouldn't want it back again

New Amsterdam it's become much too much
Till I have the possession of everything she touches
Till I step on the brakes to get out of her clutches
Till I speak double dutch to a real double duchess
Down on the mainspring, listen to the tick tock
Clock all the faces that move in on your block
Twice shy and dog tired because you've been bitten
Everything you say now sounds like it was ghost-written
Chorus
Back in London they'll take you to heart after a little while
Though I look right at home I still feel like an exile
Somehow I found myself down at the dockside
Thinking of the old days of Liverpool and Rotherhide
The transparent people who live on the other side
Living a life that is almost like suicide
Chorus

Last edited by mrschultz; 08-05-2009 at 03:13 PM.
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Old 08-05-2009, 04:53 PM
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Well, this is a good day. It is New Amsterdam/Elvis Costello. Thanks Nic. and mrschultz
I wonder why "real double duchess" + lyrics did not pull up the title for me in Google? That approach usually works.

I went plumbing to find that missing Late, Late Movie theme and did not find it, but I did find two classics, the names of which also eluded me for many years.
Fascination:



and Tenderly (nice piano ad lib here):



There was an episode of I Love Lucy, one of the "Hollywood" episodes where The Ricardos come to L.A. and Lucy goes to a ball where they play an instrumental version of Fascination. Sounds different like violinists at a bistro or an instrumental out of a 1930's Greta Garbo movie and I'd like to find the original version as the bistro version makes me laugh, but in a good way.
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Old 08-06-2009, 05:59 AM
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> I wonder why "real double duchess" + lyrics did not pull up
> the title for me in Google? That approach usually works.

wow. here's what i'm seeing on that search:
Quote:
1.
ELVIS COSTELLO - NEW AMSTERDAM LYRICS
Album. These New Amsterdam lyrics are performed by Elvis CostelloYou're sending me tulips mist. ... Till I speak double dutch to a real double duchess ...
http://www.metrolyrics.com/new-amste...-costello.html - Cached - Similar -
2.
tasmin archer - new amsterdam Lyrics|Free|Song Lyrics|Music Lyrics ...
'Til I step on the brake to get out of her clutches 'Til I speak double dutch to a real double duchess. Lyrics downloads from www.SuperLyrics.net ...
http://www.superlyrics.net/lrc_lyric...terdam_e1j.htm - Cached - Similar -
3.
ELVIS COSTELLO "NEW AMSTERDAM" Lyrics
Till I step on the brakes to get out of her clutches. Till I speak double dutch to a real double duchess. Lyrics: New Amsterdam, Elvis Costello [end] ...
www.mp3lyrics.org/e/elvis-costello/new/ - Cached - Similar -
4.
Elvis Costello Guitar Chords for - New Amsterdam Tabs, Chords, Lyrics
Can I speak Double Dutch to a real double duchess? G Em C G Down on the mainspring, listen to the tick tock, G Em F D ...
http://www.azchords.com/e/.../newams...bs-177672.html - Cached - Similar -
5.
Music and Lyrics to the song New Amsterdam by Elvis Costello ...
Till I speak double dutch to a real double duchess Down on the mainspring, listen to the tick tock Clock all the faces that move in on your block ...
http://www.rhapsody.com/elvis-costel...../lyrics.html - Cached - Similar -
6.
Tasmin Archer - New Amsterdam Track - Yahoo! Music
Lyrics. You're sending me tulips mistaken for lilies. You give me your lip after punching me silly ... Till I speak double dutch to a real double duchess ...
new.music.yahoo.com/tasmin.../new-amsterdam--441728 - Cached - Similar -
7.
New Amsterdam Lyrics - Tasmin Archer
'Til I speak double dutch to a real double duchess. Down on the main spring listen to the ... You are viewing New Amsterdam lyrics written by Tasmin Archer. ...
http://www.kovideo.net/lyrics/t/Tasm...Amsterdam.html - Cached - Similar -
8.
New Amsterdam by Elvis Costello | Free Song Lyrics | VH1.com
Till I speak double dutch to a real double duchess ... All Lyrics by Lyrics terms of service. Lyrics provided by Gracenote ...
http://www.vh1.com/artists/az/costel...51/lyric.jhtml - Cached - Similar -
9.
New Amsterdam lyrics - Elvis Costello lyrics
'New Amsterdam' lyrics from album 'Get Happy!!' of Elvis Costello. ... Till I speak double dutch to a real double duchess. Down on the mainspring, ...
http://www.allthelyrics.com/lyrics/....cs-138387.html - Cached - Similar -
10.
Elvis Costello - New Amsterdam - Code HOT UK lyrics
Code HOT UK lyrics - Artist : Elvis Costello. Song : New Amsterdam. ... clutches Till I speak double dutch to a real double duchess Down on the mainspring, ...
http://www.codehot.co.uk/lyrics/efgh...wamsterdam.htm - Cached - Similar -

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so this is not the same as what you see?
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