March 2012 the hottest month in recorded history in the US.

[Ike Savage]

WASHINGTON (AP) — It has been so warm in the United States this year, especially in March, that national records were not just broken, they were deep-fried.

Temperatures in the lower 48 states were 8.6 degrees (4.8 degrees Celsius) above normal for March and 6 degrees (3.3 degrees Celsius) higher than average for the first three months of the year, according to calculations by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. That far exceeds the old records.

...

It is important to note that this unusual winter heat is mostly a North America phenomenon. Much of the rest of the Northern Hemisphere has been cold, said NOAA meteorologist Martin Hoerling.

full article:
http://news.yahoo.com/start-2012-mar...042848594.html

crap... i was hoping that we'd be granted some more time on this issue, but it looks like the future is arriving fast.

very soon now i think the US and a few other vulnerable countries are going to have to persuade the rest of the international community to begin a program that adds particulate matter to the atmosphere in order to attempt balancing the global climate. just that there are so many ways to screw that up or create side-problems, not to mention it's a difficult economic time for such a thing. but pretty soon we may have no choice in the matter. last year some southern states like texas had an absolutely brutal summer. this year it could be much worse if the current trend continues, and that means a lot of human turmoil and big strains on FEMA, the economy, and surrounding resources.

just hope it's all an anomaly.

[druadic]

I'm sure HAARP has nothing to do with this. BS. If you're vaguely interested, look it up. It's going to get worse....just wait. What does HAARP do? It controls the weather and much much more. The earthquakes all over the world have been started with this diabolical machine located in Alaska.

There's more information out there, but most folks just don't know where to find it. If you really want some great info, check out Jesse Ventura's Conspiracy Theory on YouTube. Look for the episode about HAARP which was episode 1.

After Jesse began to look into the corruption of "Big Brother", they shut his show down. Makes you wonder what these filthbags are truly doing to the world and all of us.

Oh yes, there are quite a few episodes to check out; The Bilderburgs, The Manuchurian Candidate, FEMA camps, The JFK assassination, The NEW WORLD ORDER, and much much more. Some of it is VERY VERY disturbing.

[StevOz]

Hottest, driest month here in da south west of OZ to and all, go figure?

[Shockman]

Originally Posted by Ike Savage

crap... i was hoping that we'd be granted some more time on this issue, but it looks like the future is arriving fast.

very soon now i think the US and a few other vulnerable countries are going to have to persuade the rest of the international community to begin a program that adds particulate matter to the atmosphere in order to attempt balancing the global climate...

I find this very interesting. Is this possible? Do you mean remove carbon monoxide, encase it, or actually convert it to something else? Or are you thinking of the methane?

I wonder if anyone thought of adding more water, for more reflection?

Global warming is just one of many issues that mean the failing of the human race. Deforestation is killer, taking all the fossil water is a killer, over fishing, many more things that would be killers even if they did not contribute to global warming at all. The decades are most certainly numbered for the human race (as it exists at least). The human race has failed, I believe. It's too late. But the time anything happens it will be obvious to the most ignorant that it is too late. Sure a limited number will probably survive a long time, which would be a failing of the human race.

[Shockman]

http://www.youtube.com/movie/home-en...with-subtitles The true book of revelations.
http://www.youtube.com/movie/fuel Yeah, global warming is an also ran.
http://www.youtube.com/movie/garbage-island The synopsis says tons, it should say hundreds of millions of tons. Here pollution in water is not being measured, the water in the pollution is.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-WAG...-button&wide=1How stupid could people be? The US congress is continually changing the answer.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pktOX...-button&wide=1A guy in this uses of all words, 'Failure'.

Hulu - The Future Of Food - Watch the full movie now.

Hulu - The Future Of Food - Watch the full movie now.

[sleepy]

Why wouldn't global warming result in higher evaporation of water, resulting in denser cloud cover, resulting in cooler temperatures, rainfall and snow?

And what do you make of the Van Allen Belt?
Does the belt perhaps recycle our wastes?

Wikipedia (Links)

Van_Allen_radiation_belt

[Ike Savage]

re: HAARP,
when you add massive quantities of greenhouse gases to the atmosphere like we've been doing for the last 200 years, you force the average global temp upwards, causing consequences. it would be fun to blame conspiracy theories and evil machines, but no such explanation is needed in this case, i'm afraid.

Originally Posted by Shockman

I find this very interesting. Is this possible? Do you mean remove carbon monoxide, encase it, or actually convert it to something else? Or are you thinking of the methane?

artificial carbon sequestration has been a hot issue from what i've read, with several techniques being worked on and developed. adding particulate matter is different though, involving seeding the atmosphere with tiny bits of reflective matter, providing an artifical albedo.

Global warming is just one of many issues that mean the failing of the human race. Deforestation is killer, taking all the fossil water is a killer, over fishing, many more things that would be killers even if they did not contribute to global warming at all. The decades are most certainly numbered for the human race (as it exists at least). The human race has failed, I believe. It's too late. But the time anything happens it will be obvious to the most ignorant that it is too late. Sure a limited number will probably survive a long time, which would be a failing of the human race.

yep, agreed. at this point i'm basically just hoping we can buy ourselves a few more years through whatever means, purely for selfish reasons. i've spent most of my adult life living by green principles, however, so i'm not going to be ashamed of myself in this matter.

it's easy to be angry about all this and resentful of humanity, but the real challenge is accepting the fact that even humanity is part of natural processes. like the example of species overbloat followed by massive die-offs, just like happens with all other animals. only since we're humans, we do the whole thing a lot more high-stakes, complex and impressively, taking a bunch of other species down with us.


@water,
it's a greenhouse gas, so the net effect AFAIK is to be more of a 'troublemaker' than a relief, although it does have both properties.

there's also the fact that more clouds and more heat also mean more storms and precipitation, so just as you have more water entering the atmosphere with increased net heat, you also have more water coming back to earth. and also consequences, of course, since more unpredictability means more damage to our way of life.


i'm not a scientist, obviously, so feel free to fact check any of that. i've studied this issue for awhile as an amateur, but i do make mistakes and forget things at times.

[Shockman]

I can only go by what I read and rings logic as well.

I don't know if sleepy realizes that the terrestrial water is different than the water up around the ozone which is extra terrestrial. Terrestrial water re-condenses at relative low altitude.

The clouds will be denser though, where there are clouds, that much is true. Where there isn't will be parched.

[mrschultz]

Originally Posted by Ike Savage

there's also the fact that more clouds and more heat also mean more storms and precipitation, so just as you have more water entering the atmosphere with increased net heat, you also have more water coming back to earth. and also consequences, of course, since more unpredictability means more damage to our way of life.

This is the real trouble maker, weather events will become more extreme, we've already begun to see what could be the start of a trend in that direction the last several years. Extreme weather leads to crop failures, and with increased population any major disruption in food production will start the snowball rolling downhill....

[Shockman]

I mentioned fossil water, which the third world largely depends. This is almost gone, at least where it is needed most. Fossil water is a non renewable resource. Without a helpful weather system, which is barely helpful anyway, some countries could be doomed fairly early in the end time.

It has happened before without global warming driving it. Easter island was deforestation.

The human race has failed. It has failed not only it's planet, but it has failed the human race. In some cases real single human beings are to blame. Even the global perspective is a small percent is to blame. A very small percent holding the lions share of the wealth, much of this wealth was timber, oil, and such, which they surly did not 'own'.

Third world countries have fallen victim to the greed of the leading nations. Colonization, has pillaged nations and left them condemned to remain in the third world. It has allowed the resources those countries own to be taken and used to produce goods by the plunderers in the plunderers countries, with the plunderers labels. UK, and US are the leading culprits. The human race has failed.

The cotton producers of America lobbied to make hemp, one of the most, if not the most prolific fiber and bio-mass plants to be made an illegal substance. Why, because it is better in every way than cotton. Textile, fiber, fuel, seed oil, everything. One years growth of that is equal to a few years growth of timber. Some people have cultivated it and genetically engineered it to be potent drug, but that same engineering increased the beneficial properties and mass as well. And when are drugs a bad thing that should not exist? The human race missed the boat.

A small percent of humans control a large percent the wealth, and create most of the pollution. Those that rape the earth of it's resources make the most money, and pays the least taxes, and sell our material to us with un-human profit. The fact that this happens does not in and of it's self mean the failing of the human race. The fact that it is allowed to happen is the failing.

War. Needs no explanation. But we are still talking most often about a few people controlling a large number. War has costed the human race everything. I personally don't think it is worth anything, and it has costed everything.

The water rebellion in Bolivia is one example of a stand and attitude that is far too rare in the human race. This angers me, because it took a stupid and blatant act to cause this reaction. One country going in and raping a small section of a country and taxing everything. When it came to water they were at the line. No farther. When they included rain water in that tax, (or was it an exclusive rights, meaning to collect rain water was to steal from the invaders) they crossed the line. This is what colonization is though, this is just the end of the scale and nothing is below the mid line. Humans have failed the human race. Ignorance and stupidity, greed and evilness had put an end to the human race.

The race will not continue without it's home world. That kind of science fiction does not exist, but it could have. Another failing. This all equals that failing. A comet the size of Saturn smashing into Earth would have no impact on the human race.

[sleepy]

All I know is, this part of town is the desert, sandy and dry except in the Spring.
For the last several days, the daytimes have been ~85 degrees, but today we had rain and Hail with a cold snap.
This time of year we often have several very warm days (with mass evaporation of water from the coast) followed by days of morning fog or drizzles/rain, but hail is still unusual around these parts.
Although, every so many years we do see snow in L.A., maybe once every ten years or more, though it doesn't lay for long.

The morning fog is most prominent along the coast after several days of sun, especially in the Summer with 100+ degree temperatures inland. In the Valley deserts we bake 100+ F., but cut to the beach and it's foggy and cool.

[sleepy]

About carbon dioxide, plants convert CO2 to O2 through the action of sunshine on their leaves. O2 is what we breathe and CO2 is what we exhale, according to school. Plants keep the carbon for carbohydrate production; starches and sugars.

So is global warming a matter of excess production of CO2 beyond nature's capability to recycle it to O2, or is it a lack of plants in our "civilized world".

I thought photosynthesis was the reason for protecting the rain forests, to prevent global warming.

[Ike Savage]

@shockman,
pretty much agree with all of that.

it can be really hard these days to look at any accomplishment of man's and get too excited, knowing what the real price was for such a thing. knowing that a culture based on such advancements has its own expiration built in, and 99%+ of those accomplishments will be useless rubbish, eventually.

either live in accord with natural law or in the end get balanced by natural law. when it comes down to it, it's pretty much that simple for civilisation. but evidently you don't get that easy vantage point until late in the game.

seems like every few days i read about some new aspect of the growing problem. humanity is getting hit in a hundred directions at once, and very few of those vectors are even at medium strength yet. yikes.

OTOH, i try to keep things in perspective. none of us chose to be born in this time period, and we've been heavily conditioned since birth to just accept the working model. questioning authority is easy, something any scrub can do, but questioning the nature of civilisation and modern man is very hard work when done patiently and rationally- something i aspire to as a wannabe thinker, but obviously struggle with.

but we live like kings today. many people here probably have a majority of ancestors who lived through the middle ages in europe, for example. that was a perfectly dreadful time to be alive IMO. extreme poverty, early death, terrible education and complete lack of life options was the norm. so even if my life ended tomorrow, even having spent most of my life in poor health, i have had it so, so much easier than my predecessors in that roughly-1,000 year stretch. it's incredible.

another way i sometimes look at it is that we have the privilege of living within the fabled bubble of atlantis. the real, genuine atlantis. meaning, out of all the humans that have ever lived, we have the unique opportunity to have lived in the most amazing technological realm in all of earth's history. and of course, probably, we also have to be around when it falls. but, hey- is that really such a high price to pay for the privilege?

OTOH, information overload can be a bitch. one still needs peacefulness and enjoyment in their life, no matter what.

[Ike Savage]

Originally Posted by sleepy

So is global warming a matter of excess production of CO2 beyond nature's capability to recycle it to O2, or is it a lack of plants in our "civilized world".

I thought photosynthesis was the reason for protecting the rain forests, to prevent global warming.

yes, that's right- the earth has some giant carbon sinks in the ocean and its biomass, but we have been going over that amount every year for some time now, which explains the net carbon increase in the atmosphere. and unlike atmospheric water, which quickly corrects itself, carbon takes a long time to sequester naturally.

re: your Q,
the rainforests are the biggest terrestrial sinks. not sure what the sequestration levels are for flora in urban areas, if that's what you meant.

i recommend watching wonderingmind's (greg craven's) youtube intro to the subject. or just read the WP page, or something. there's a lot of good primers out there, although there's also some deliberate misinformation sources, as well.

[sleepy]

Yep, I meant our "civilized world" of excessive concrete and no plants.

[faralos]

and let's not forget the bee problem too
if the honeybees were to die off we would too
since they spread most of the worlds pollen around
funny how it's the little things that seem to matter most
as many people poo poo the fact that bees help keep us alive
through cross pollination

[faralos]

Originally Posted by sleepy

Yep, I meant our "civilized world" of excessive concrete and no plants.

just like the old film "silent running" which tells of how we
got rid of all the forests on earth and paved the whole world over

[Ike Savage]

Originally Posted by faralos

just like the old film "silent running" which tells of how we
got rid of all the forests on earth and paved the whole world over

yea, well, it seemed like a good idea at the time.