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  #1  
Old 03-01-2014, 05:25 AM
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Default VP DX9 latest test builds.

I'm uploading these open source based test builds here for testing for those that are not members of http://www.vpforums.org

Be aware these are test builds and text decals and text boxes are not implemented, also graphic decals over lights do not work in the backdrop, thus far.

REF: http://www.vpforums.org/index.php?showtopic=26714

Quote:
Important: instead of fullscreen mode, run in "windowed fullscreen" mode. If you get flicker, please try disabling AA.
Table compatibility spreadsheet (thanks to gtxjoe): https://docs.google....EPwri8/viewform

As is the tradition, here's a new test version for the weekend. There are relatively few major changes this time as we inch closer and closer to a stable renderer.

If you still get black insert lights on a table, please first try going through the table's playfield GI textures (usually called playfield_XX or similar) which are black where the lights are located, and set their transparency color to pure black.

Changes since Test6:
  • fixed wrong computation of near and far Z planes. This had a dramatic effect on the precision of the depth buffer, especially on full-screen tables, and fixed (to my knowledge) all known cases of Z fighting involving lights.
  • made decals properly render over lights everywhere on the playfield (Barracora)
  • gates now respect the visibility flag set from script properly
  • "Alternate render" option removed
  • (toxie) DirectInput reverted to version 7 since 8 caused issues for many people using frontends.
As usual, if you find glitches, screenshots and exact table names/versions help a lot to track them down! Also please take a moment to enter the data into the spreadsheet linked above if you can.

Happy testing!
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Old 03-01-2014, 01:43 PM
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Thanks for mirroring these.


Regarding test 7

The red lights in the PAC-MAZE is erasing the yellow lights, but they reset correctly when the maze is reset. And most often the red lights do not even show up in attract mode. Yellow lights almost never.

The gate fix worked.

Texture maps wrapped on side walls show a distinct line where the shading changes.

Pic-1
This is how VP DX9 spells Y

Pics-2 and 3
The only other issue.
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  #3  
Old 03-01-2014, 11:43 PM
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Hi Phil and Steve.

They are doing some nice work if you play VP in a cab. I'd actually like to have a cab, but too fucking old to go through all that to play video pinball standing up.

I hope they fix those decals and text boxes.

Seems like all new people in this scene, it is so commercial and serious anymore.... They have no idea of all the fun they missed in getting VP to this stage.
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  #4  
Old 03-02-2014, 01:04 AM
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I'm past the point in life of getting excited about building a cab to play a video game in too, but if it is the only thing driving the video games' further development, so be it. I could always build a $20 stand to hold a couple monitors if that is all it takes to render the games.
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Old 03-02-2014, 01:07 AM
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Bob, that's what stools were invented for, though yeah you would most likely fall off trying to nudge it.

Also shocky has a point you can get some very nice vesa arm stands to suit, if you really want to go there, my monitor rotates, though I never use that as I prefer the old style rendering and gameplay.
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Old 03-05-2014, 06:32 AM
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Quote:
Important: instead of fullscreen mode, run in "windowed fullscreen" mode. If you get flicker, please disable AA.
Table compatibility spreadsheet (thanks to gtxjoe): https://docs.google....EPwri8/viewform

Ok, I think we've accumulated enough stuff to warrant a new test version.

If you still get black insert lights on a table, please first try going through the table's playfield GI textures (usually called playfield_XX, pfX, or similar) which are black where the lights are located, and set their transparency color to pure black.

When reporting an issue, please first make sure it's not already in the list of known general issues or table issues below! If it's not, then please add it in the form above.

As usual, if you find glitches: screenshots and exact table names/versions help a lot to track them down!


Changes since Test7:
  • decals now have a much smaller depth bias
  • fixed hash collisions occurring on texture lookups (shrunken head on RBION)
  • fixed rendering of ball shadows and decals; this should also get rid of some glitches
  • flashers are now correctly depth sorted
  • optimizations to spinner and ball rendering
  • average and max frame time is now shown on FPS display (F11). Check and report this if you have stutter issues!
  • fixed some uninitialized memory accesses

Known general issues:
*) textboxes don't work
*) EM reels only work in Image Reel mode, not Text Reel
*) text decals don't work
*) kickers cut the ball in half
*) some depth ordering issues remain
*) Stereo 3D only works on NVIDIA so far
*) AA hardwired to 4xMSAA, flickers
*) textures aren't preloaded, can lead to stutter in some cases
*) screen shake doesn't work
*) adaptive vsync always falls back to normal vsync (can only be supported if we drop XP)
*) stereo3D parameters are different
*) "real" full screen mode doesn't work with VPM/B2S. Instead, use "Windowed fullscreen" mode.
*) lost devices aren't handled properly (real fullscreen issue only)

Known specific table issues:
https://docs.google....p=sharing#gid=0

Happy testing!

Edited by mukuste, Today, 06:56 PM.



Latest test build attached.
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  #7  
Old 03-05-2014, 06:35 PM
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New test 8a version, test 8 was a mistake.
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  #8  
Old 03-09-2014, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Here's the traditional weekend test release. This time we have mostly internal changes which are not directly user-visible, but may have some effect on smoothness/stuttering, so I'm especially interested in how it compares to Test8 in this regard. Raw FPS may be a bit lower. These changes are still experimental at this point!

Also try the new frame limiting feature by toxie, enabled by setting the vsync field higher than refresh rate!

If you still get black insert lights on a table, please first try going through the table's playfield GI textures (usually called playfield_XX, pfX, or similar) which are black where the lights are located, and set their transparency color to pure black.

When reporting an issue, please first make sure it's not already in the list of known general issues or table issues below! If it's not, then please add it in the form above. Also, screenshots and exact table names/versions help a lot to track any glitches down!


Changes since Test8:
  • Maximum pre-rendered frames are now limited to 2. See the recently posted technical information. This might become a GUI option in the future.
  • Major optimizations to moving primitives
  • Decals AGAIN have a much smaller depth bias. (Barracora is now considered as a buggy table since it has lights at height 1 but decals at height 0. Apologies to JF, you had the right idea there!)
  • Some new performance counters on F11 display, probably not interesting to general public.
  • (toxie) vsync setting can now be used as a frame limiter if set higher than refresh rate
  • (toxie) optimizations to octrees
Known general issues:
*) textboxes don't work
*) EM reels only work in Image Reel mode, not Text Reel
*) text decals don't work
*) kickers cut the ball in half
*) some depth ordering issues remain
*) Stereo 3D only works on NVIDIA so far
*) AA hardwired to 4xMSAA, flickers
*) textures aren't preloaded, can lead to stutter in some cases
*) screen shake doesn't work
*) adaptive vsync always falls back to normal vsync (can only be supported if we drop XP)
*) stereo3D parameters are different
*) "real" full screen mode doesn't work with VPM/B2S. Instead, use "Windowed fullscreen" mode.
*) lost devices aren't handled properly (real fullscreen issue only)

Known specific table issues:
https://docs.google....p=sharing#gid=0

Happy testing!

Edited by mukuste, Yesterday, 04:53 PM.



latest test build attached..
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  #9  
Old 03-09-2014, 07:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shockman View Post
I could always build a $20 stand to hold a couple monitors if that is all it takes to render the games.
That's all my cab really is. An oversized gamepad that holds 2 monitors. The desktop I'm on right now runs my cab.

All you really need to play is:

Cabinet
Buttons, wires
Ipac
2 screens
Computer
Hell, add a joystick and you're good for Mame too.

You can really get stupid on this stuff like shaker motors, lights, real dmd, etc. But to actually play, that's all you need. I use a windows hotkey (windows/p, windows 7) to go between duplicate/extend to play or work on the same pc.
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Old 03-11-2014, 08:39 AM
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man I have enough problems trying to keep my wip's running in the working vp editor
let alone a buggy version! but I'll give it a go anyhow...thanks for the update release
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Old 03-11-2014, 09:37 AM
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Faralos, here's what my plan is:
I'm sure a lot of tables will not work the same- they'll be under 9.2 (latest version). Anything new will work under the new Directx9 vp. I'm planning to make Hyperpin/PinballX work with both .exe's at the same time.

I have over 450 tables on my cab, and I'm still adding. There's no way in hell I'm updating them all.
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Old 03-11-2014, 12:11 PM
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Quote:
Changes since Test8:
Maximum pre-rendered frames are now limited to 2. See the recently posted technical information. This might become a GUI option in the future.
Major optimizations to moving primitives
Decals AGAIN have a much smaller depth bias. (Barracora is now considered as a buggy table since it has lights at height 1 but decals at height 0. Apologies to JF, you had the right idea there!)
Some new performance counters on F11 display, probably not interesting to general public.
(toxie) vsync setting can now be used as a frame limiter if set higher than refresh rate
(toxie) optimizations to octrees
Quote:
Known general issues:
*) textboxes don't work
*) EM reels only work in Image Reel mode, not Text Reel
*) text decals don't work
*) kickers cut the ball in half
*) some depth ordering issues remain
*) Stereo 3D only works on NVIDIA so far
*) AA hardwired to 4xMSAA, flickers
*) textures aren't preloaded, can lead to stutter in some cases
*) screen shake doesn't work
*) adaptive vsync always falls back to normal vsync (can only be supported if we drop XP)
*) stereo3D parameters are different
*) "real" full screen mode doesn't work with VPM/B2S. Instead, u
The second list is getting longer and does not even include all the problems.

The first list is always a variation on the same issues. Issues that even if sorted will surely pop up again when the elements from the second list is put back in, or enabled. It's a formula that has never worked with VP regardless of the years of effort. Refining something draw order Refining something draw order Refining something draw order refining something plunger device dead zone refining something plunger device dead zone refining something plunger device dead zone refining something plunger device dead zone, and the bugs pile up and pile up.

A buggy DX12 Visual pinball is not going to be great, let alone a buggy DX9 version

VP has draw in front and draw in back. I have called Visual Pinball a POS. If VP DX9> has draw in front and draw in back as a method to order 5 objects, I predict I will call it a POS too.
If the image manager changes my transparency settings even once regardless of my system or GPU. VP DX9 will be a POS.
If nudging recoil is not put back in. VP DX9 will be POS.

Last edited by Shockman; 03-11-2014 at 12:56 PM.
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Old 03-21-2014, 05:06 AM
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Quote:
Important: instead of fullscreen mode, run in "windowed fullscreen" mode. If you get flicker, please disable 4xMSAA.
Try the frame limiter, e.g. at 120 fps, for smoother gameplay!
Table compatibility spreadsheet (thanks to gtxjoe): https://docs.google....EPwri8/viewform

This is a bit of a disappointing release because I spent pretty much all the time debugging that blasted collision issue. Still I wanted to put something out for the weekend that people can enjoy hopefully without the crashes of the last version.

Changes since Test10:
  • fixed memory corruption problem in KD-tree which led to occasional crashes
  • reverted collision for static elements to use original quadtree instead of KD-tree, with some extra optimizations and cleanup. Should now hopefully behave reasonably close to original VP again.
  • fixed long-standing glitches due to habitrail rendering (thanks DJRobX)
  • compatibility fix to make lighting work properly for primitive meshes (reported by kiwi)
Known general issues:
*) textboxes don't work
*) EM reels only work in Image Reel mode, not Text Reel
*) text decals don't work
*) kickers cut the ball in half
*) some depth ordering issues remain
*) Stereo 3D only works on NVIDIA so far
*) AA hardwired to 4xMSAA, flickers
*) textures aren't preloaded, can lead to stutter in some cases
*) screen shake doesn't work
*) adaptive vsync always falls back to normal vsync (can only be supported if we drop XP)
*) stereo3D parameters are different
*) "real" full screen mode doesn't work with VPM/B2S. Instead, use "Windowed fullscreen" mode.
*) lost devices aren't handled properly (real fullscreen issue only)

Known specific table issues:
https://docs.google....p=sharing#gid=0

Happy testing!


Buggy or not these are test builds, render, far better without the jaggies and are far faster on lesser hardware.

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Old 03-21-2014, 10:54 PM
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There are 6 issues in the Known General issues that effect my table, one of which is a killer, but you are right, I have ran some tables that looked better and worked very well in the DX9 build.
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Old 03-21-2014, 11:01 PM
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I have read at VPF that the full install of Visual Pinball v9.2.1 is a prerequisite to the DX9 version.

Could you see about mirroring that here?
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Old 03-22-2014, 06:31 AM
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Though I doubt you really need it, here ya go...

http://www.pinballnirvana.com/module...ull_Install%29
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Old 03-22-2014, 08:45 AM
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Thanks. It does not change a lot in the end, but it is nice to have the tables associated correctly. Before if I clicked on a table in the tables folder, or a shortcut to a table there, I would get an empty v1.5 editor. Now the table loads and runs with the v2.1 editor.
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Old 03-30-2014, 01:17 PM
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With the light stacking order fixes from a couple of revs back, and especially now with the proprietary registry entries, I would love to give this another test.

rev 978 please.
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Old 03-30-2014, 06:45 PM
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Here ya go..

Quote:
And another update rev978. Since this revision VP9 DX9 uses it's own registry subfolder so it won't interfere with the DX7 settings anymore. Settings are stored in the registry here:
Compute\HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Visual Pinball\DX9

If you use this revision you have to set your settings again.
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Old 03-31-2014, 12:22 PM
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Thanks again.

I loaded mmpac and the maze lights worked correctly. It crashed when I exited, after doing nothing but looking and now it won't even load again. With no uninstall, I have to clean my registry.

The maze lights show that progress is being made, but in the future I will be the closer to last to try it.

Windows 8 64bit AMD 12gig ATI
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Old 04-17-2014, 06:34 AM
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OK..try this one, runs a treat here on my new computer.

Quote:
Important: instead of fullscreen mode, run in "windowed fullscreen" mode. If you get flicker, please disable 4xMSAA.
Try the frame limiter, e.g. at 120 fps, for smoother gameplay!
Table compatibility spreadsheet (thanks to gtxjoe): https://docs.google....EPwri8/viewform

Since my other project is now out there, I've gone back to the DX9 port for a bit and put some work towards the to-do list remaining before the official release. It's mostly GUI stuff and the annoying kicker issue left now. There's also some crucial bugfixes. So this should be a good time for a new release.

Be aware that since this version uses its own registry key, you'll have to reset all options!

Changes since Test13:
  • Textboxes work now
  • Text decals work now
  • made a fix which should allow VP to work properly both as non-admin and as admin (hopefully no more weird crashes)
  • removed UAC option from build (you have to choose "Run as administrator" manually if you want it, but in most cases you shouldn't need it anymore)
  • (fuzzel) DX9 version now uses a separate registry key
  • (fuzzel) some changes to ramp/wall transparency (he'll have to weigh in here, I didn't follow these changes closely; I think he reverted some of my previous changes too)
Known specific table issues:
https://docs.google....p=sharing#gid=0
Frame limiter does not work for me, much smoother experience here letting it run at 700+ FPS. Also do not enable 4xAntiAlising, does nothing here but cause the ball to appear as if it stutters, Force Anisotropic and quality FXAA works best here.
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Old 04-21-2014, 10:45 AM
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Thanks.

I tried this one because of the text fixes.

There are a couple of good things I can say about it. It runs, shuts down without crashing and runs again. Also the black lines missing from the edges of targets and walls is a good thing. My targets are textured to look sculpted, and have never looked better.

The text does show on decals... kinda. Lights don't look the same, and there are blocks around most of the graphics. These are not there in any form. They are created by these builds. I can fix the text decals, but not the lights, but compatibility to me means just that, no fixing.

Though some of this is reported by others, a lot of it could probably be resolved with a different GPU.

I don't understand VP DX9 as a concept with DX10 in planing. Not when the focus is a player that is just like DX7 (compatibility). We have players for existing table builds, so if the compatibility is not 100% it is going to be a net loss and waste of time in my opinion.

I'm more excited about DX10 even if it is a couple of years away, but mostly about the new physics build even though it is DX7. I hope that shows up mirrored somewhere so I could check it out.
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Old 04-22-2014, 07:35 AM
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Figured shock man is back to bitching...

I for one am grateful for any improvements to vp. And vpdx9 has blown me away.

Shockman, go cry a river else where, stick to building outdated tables, and let thoose of us that want to see this hobby grow, grow. No one needs to update anything, and if they choose to play your 1980's version on vp, they can.

Me, it's 2014. And it's only getting better.

Just returning after 2 years, it's sweet seeing how much has grown and changed for the better, yet I still have to lol at how some people haven't. Lol

H4CK3R
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Old 04-22-2014, 10:51 AM
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I happen to like 80's pins and so does a lot of other people.

I point out the good things and the bad things, anything less is non-useful.

I also work with what I have. I have discovered that I can fix the plastics' graphic glitches by setting the top height of the wall that pops up much higher than the other one. Before, any higher would work, including fractional values. You can usually tell if an object is shifting position instead of just changing texture though.

I also know I can fix the lights by using world mapped images and I will if I can get the blocks that show on the floor next to objects fixed.

No one is a bigger fan of pinball, real or virtual, including VP, than I am. I just see it as it is, and not through rose colored glasses. Some people are saying at VPF that VP as it is now is un-playable and not getting this kind of argument. I however have always said that the physics are weak at best, but never that it was un-playable.

I also never said that DX9 was a bad Idea. I only said I don't understand DX9 as a replacement, even interim. If it was made with DX5, would DX7 then make sense at this point?

Thankfully, the newer devs WANT to read about the problems and note them. This is the best change VP could undergo.
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